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gavin
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i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same
you come at the king....you best not miss
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Furly
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
well said.
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Lucabrasi
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
Everyone has an opinion and I think everyone has the
right to voice there opinion as long as its done with some respect towards the other person. Moreover I cannot imagine random making this thread
without thinking this kind of discussion would happen...
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Lucabrasi
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
Everyone has an opinion and I think everyone has the
right to voice there opinion as long as its done with some respect towards the other person. Moreover I cannot imagine random making this thread
without thinking this kind of discussion would happen... |
anyone CAN voice their opinion
the problem lies in some people thinking that their opinion is more valid than the next persons
personally, my sensibilities are offended when i hear that someone is a fan of shelter for example.
BUT i would never think that just because i find them highly offensive, that im any better or that im correct over someone who enjoys listening to
them.
if someone gets something that i dont out of such a band, then more power to them.
just as, if i listen to skrewdriver and you dont get it, then thats the way it is.
im able to listen to certain things and not take it to heart.
i dont allow any music, or movies or any media outlet for that matter to form my opinions for me.
i like to think of myself as a free thinker who is able to make up my own mind on subjects and am able to find some entertainment in certain things i
dont agree with 100%.
my horizons are pretty broad and i am willing to learn from things that i dont happen to agree with or understand and THEN form my opinion on such.
you come at the king....you best not miss
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newbreedbrian
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well said geoff, and I think that just comes with age really. the older I get the more I realize things aren't always black and white (pardon the pun
:smilegrin and I don't always feel the need to be right.
The very existence of flamethrowers proves that sometime, somewhere, someone said to themselves, ?You know, I want to set those people over there on
fire, but I?m just not close enough to get the job done.? George Carlin
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Siczine.com
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
I won't argue that. But everyone at one time or another during the day, week, month, lifetime will have an "opinion" and think it is right and argue
to the death about. Things like religion and politics are more opinion based than fact based but yet people will argue it like there are facts
involved.
That's just how EVERYONE is conditioned, not just people in this country. The terrorist that commit suicide do so because they think their "opinion"
is worth dying for. The Christians have killed countless people, over an "opinion".
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
I won't argue that. But everyone at one time or another during the day, week, month, lifetime will have an "opinion" and think it is right and argue
to the death about. Things like religion and politics are more opinion based than fact based but yet people will argue it like there are facts
involved.
That's just how EVERYONE is conditioned, not just people in this country. The terrorist that commit suicide do so because they think their "opinion"
is worth dying for. The Christians have killed countless people, over an "opinion". |
i can only speak for myself and say my opinions are right for ME and ME only.
i dont pretend to know more than anyone else
i only know whats best for me.
therfore, my opinions are indeed right but are only right for myself.
i dont and would never think that my thoughts on things are are the be all end of of right or wrong.
that's a silly, self rightous thought process.
people in general think they are smarter than they are and think that their thoughts on things are what's best for everyone.
that's just not the case.
while i may agree with ones opinions, that does not make it the "right" opinion, since really there is no such thing.
so, bottom line, i dont and wont think that any of my opinions are right for anyone else other than myself.
if you think that you're opinon on skrewdriver or anything else is so rightous and true that it should be the rule, you are sadly misguided my frind.
you come at the king....you best not miss
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Siczine.com
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
i actually love when these sort of discussions come up
i find it really funny how people forget that it's all opinions
and no ones is right and no ones is wrong
people are allowed to have any opinion of things they wanna have
and are allowed to interprit things like skrewdriver or wharever else they way they feel they want to
but one persons opinion is not a fact
just because you may think something is right or wrong does not make it right or wrong for everyone else
this is one of the biggest problems in the country today
people arent allowed to have an opinion on something without someone else telling them how wrong they are
live and let live people
it would be a boring place if we all thought the same |
I won't argue that. But everyone at one time or another during the day, week, month, lifetime will have an "opinion" and think it is right and argue
to the death about. Things like religion and politics are more opinion based than fact based but yet people will argue it like there are facts
involved.
That's just how EVERYONE is conditioned, not just people in this country. The terrorist that commit suicide do so because they think their "opinion"
is worth dying for. The Christians have killed countless people, over an "opinion". |
i can only speak for myself and say my opinions are right for ME and ME only.
i dont pretend to know more than anyone else
i only know whats best for me.
therfore, my opinions are indeed right but are only right for myself.
i dont and would never think that my thoughts on things are are the be all end of of right or wrong.
that's a silly, self rightous thought process.
people in general think they are smarter than they are and think that their thoughts on things are what's best for everyone.
that's just not the case.
while i may agree with ones opinions, that does not make it the "right" opinion, since really there is no such thing.
so, bottom line, i dont and wont think that any of my opinions are right for anyone else other than myself.
if you think that you're opinon on skrewdriver or anything else is so rightous and true that it should be the rule, you are sadly misguided my frind.
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Righteous, the rule? Man, all I did was state my view/opinion, as did everyone else.
So if people don't agree or have different opinions that means they just shouldn't discuss it at all? Fuck that. I said my opinion, you didn't like
it. You said you're opinion, I didn't like it. End of story.
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gavin
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saying..."Screwdriver, Racewar? What are you a white supremacist?" smells to me as someone looking to down anothers opinion as opposed to say
"blah...i dont dig any of that stuff"
you see the difference?
you come at the king....you best not miss
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Siczine.com
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
saying..."Screwdriver, Racewar? What are you a white supremacist?" smells to me as someone looking to down anothers opinion as opposed to say
"blah...i dont dig any of that stuff"
you see the difference? |
I see your point and perhaps I did come off a bit argumentative.
But I will say, if someone is a racist, than yeah I don't dig any of that stuff. I think if you are a racist, you are a ignorant person. Just like
how everyone on here can agree a rapist is the lowest of the low. What is so different from what I said about racism as opposed to looking down on a
child rapist. Every time you put down a rapist are you not making yourself out to be "righteous"?
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
saying..."Screwdriver, Racewar? What are you a white supremacist?" smells to me as someone looking to down anothers opinion as opposed to say
"blah...i dont dig any of that stuff"
you see the difference? |
I see your point and perhaps I did come off a bit argumentative.
But I will say, if someone is a racist, than yeah I don't dig any of that stuff. I think if you are a racist, you are a ignorant person. Just like
how everyone on here can agree a rapist is the lowest of the low. What is so different from what I said about racism as opposed to looking down on a
child rapist. Every time you put down a rapist are you not making yourself out to be "righteous"? |
interesting point
but
someone who has fucked up views is different than someone who takes action on these views.
racism is something i strongly disagree with.
BUT i dont care if someone else is a racist.
its not my business or place to judge what someone thinks.
now a rapist has actually done an act.
there's a HUGE difference in holding an unpopular opinion and doing an act of violence on someone.
we are talking about thoughts as oppossed to actions here.
actions become another discussion all together.
you come at the king....you best not miss
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Siczine.com
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
saying..."Screwdriver, Racewar? What are you a white supremacist?" smells to me as someone looking to down anothers opinion as opposed to say
"blah...i dont dig any of that stuff"
you see the difference? |
I see your point and perhaps I did come off a bit argumentative.
But I will say, if someone is a racist, than yeah I don't dig any of that stuff. I think if you are a racist, you are a ignorant person. Just like
how everyone on here can agree a rapist is the lowest of the low. What is so different from what I said about racism as opposed to looking down on a
child rapist. Every time you put down a rapist are you not making yourself out to be "righteous"? |
interesting point
but
someone who has fucked up views is different than someone who takes action on these views.
racism is something i strongly disagree with.
BUT i dont care if someone else is a racist.
its not my business or place to judge what someone thinks.
now a rapist has actually done an act.
there's a HUGE difference in holding an unpopular opinion and doing an act of violence on someone.
we are talking about thoughts as oppossed to actions here.
actions become another discussion all together. |
Alright then what about a person that watches child porn? They don't commit an act but in their own mind. Isn't that still something that warrants
condemnation and harsh "opinions".
And a racist person usually acts out their racism to others, so it affects others. I don't know, if a black person called me a cracker, their racism
interferes with me. And then you have those extreme racists that commit hate crimes.
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Mark Lind
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I'm gonna take the bait on this one......
Only in punk rock is something like this acceptable. Think about it...... why is it ok to be into the racist stuff as long as it's set to music? You
can't get away with it in any other environment. You can't tell racist jokes around the water cooler at work and then say you don't really mean it. Do
you know what I mean?
People can do what they want with their time. It's all the excuses and absolutions that go along with it in the punk rock scene that make me chuckle.
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XHonusWagnerX
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
I'm gonna take the bait on this one......
Only in punk rock is something like this acceptable. Think about it...... why is it ok to be into the racist stuff as long as it's set to music? You
can't get away with it in any other environment. You can't tell racist jokes around the water cooler at work and then say you don't really mean it. Do
you know what I mean?
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But can you laugh at a racist joke and not be racist? I feel like I fall into that catagory. And that can be laughing at a white comedian like Artie
Lange or a black comedian like Chris Rock.
| Quote: | Originally posted by REV.PAULIE
HONUS-as much as i can't stand a great deal of what you really like (for my own reasons that i would never hold,nor impose,against you),YOU FUCKING
RULE!
YOU,HONUS,IS WHAT MAKES THE "EDGE" COOL.
YOUR FRIEND,
PAULIE |
check out my post contributions at www.VinylNoize.com
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Mark Lind
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I know what you mean but I don't think the comparison stands up. Those people are comedians..... they're trying to make you laugh. Skrewdriver isn't
trying to make you laugh although some of it is pretty hilarious.
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SS76
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I'm no racist, but the jokes are always funny. Where do white supremacists keep their life savings? In a 401kkk account. (from this month's Hustler)
Personally, I could give a fuck less what the singer says; I'd take most of my favorite shit in instrumental form if I could. I've never even heard a
Skrewdriver song either so I can't comment on that.
Silence is golden but violence is platinum. |
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
I'm gonna take the bait on this one......
Only in punk rock is something like this acceptable. Think about it...... why is it ok to be into the racist stuff as long as it's set to music? You
can't get away with it in any other environment. You can't tell racist jokes around the water cooler at work and then say you don't really mean it. Do
you know what I mean?
People can do what they want with their time. It's all the excuses and absolutions that go along with it in the punk rock scene that make me chuckle.
|
im making no excusses for anything i like.
i like what i like.
again, i am able to get entertainment value out of things that i dont agree with.
another example is the dwarves.
they have songs about drug use.
i have never used drugs in my life(besides smoking weed like 3 times when i was in my early 20s)
but that dosent mean i cant listen to it because i dont do it.
i listen to alot of jah loving, pot smoking reggae music.
am i a pot smoking jah loving rasta guy?
no.
i have used this example on here before but....
there are death metal bands that sing about all kinds of crazyness.
do i like it?
no.
do i judge someone who listens to it?
no.
do i think that just because someone gets some enjoyment out of these types of bands that they do or believe everything or anything that these bands
say?
certainly not.
someone can listen to rap music that talks about shooting people in the head(myself included)
does that mean that every person listening to these songs is a gang bangin head shootin dude?
nope. again, it means nothing other than the fact that they enjoy listening to it.
so, do all these people have to make excusses for enjoying these types of music?
or is it just the fact that skrewdriver rubs you so wrong that you feel anyone who enjoys them is making "excusses"?
you come at the king....you best not miss
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
| Quote: | Originally posted by Siczine.com
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
saying..."Screwdriver, Racewar? What are you a white supremacist?" smells to me as someone looking to down anothers opinion as opposed to say
"blah...i dont dig any of that stuff"
you see the difference? |
I see your point and perhaps I did come off a bit argumentative.
But I will say, if someone is a racist, than yeah I don't dig any of that stuff. I think if you are a racist, you are a ignorant person. Just like
how everyone on here can agree a rapist is the lowest of the low. What is so different from what I said about racism as opposed to looking down on a
child rapist. Every time you put down a rapist are you not making yourself out to be "righteous"? |
interesting point
but
someone who has fucked up views is different than someone who takes action on these views.
racism is something i strongly disagree with.
BUT i dont care if someone else is a racist.
its not my business or place to judge what someone thinks.
now a rapist has actually done an act.
there's a HUGE difference in holding an unpopular opinion and doing an act of violence on someone.
we are talking about thoughts as oppossed to actions here.
actions become another discussion all together. |
Alright then what about a person that watches child porn? They don't commit an act but in their own mind. Isn't that still something that warrants
condemnation and harsh "opinions".
And a racist person usually acts out their racism to others, so it affects others. I don't know, if a black person called me a cracker, their racism
interferes with me. And then you have those extreme racists that commit hate crimes. |
watching child porn is still an action.
its kinda tough to compare the 2.
lets say someone is really anti-gay, like alot of rap music over time has been.
do i agree with that?
fuck no.
my father is gay.
BUT...can i listen to something that uses the word faggot and get some entertainment out of it?
yes i can.
there's nothing wrong with having an opinion on something no matter how fucked up that opinion may seem to be to others.
im about as anti-racist and anti-homophobic as it gets.
BUT people have the right to think what they want about it.
when these people ACT on these thoughts or opinions, THATS when it becoames a different ballgame.
you come at the king....you best not miss
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XHonusWagnerX
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
I know what you mean but I don't think the comparison stands up. Those people are comedians..... they're trying to make you laugh. Skrewdriver isn't
trying to make you laugh although some of it is pretty hilarious. |
yeah... thats true. I didnt really think of it from that side.
| Quote: | Originally posted by REV.PAULIE
HONUS-as much as i can't stand a great deal of what you really like (for my own reasons that i would never hold,nor impose,against you),YOU FUCKING
RULE!
YOU,HONUS,IS WHAT MAKES THE "EDGE" COOL.
YOUR FRIEND,
PAULIE |
check out my post contributions at www.VinylNoize.com
|
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Mark Lind
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
I'm gonna take the bait on this one......
Only in punk rock is something like this acceptable. Think about it...... why is it ok to be into the racist stuff as long as it's set to music? You
can't get away with it in any other environment. You can't tell racist jokes around the water cooler at work and then say you don't really mean it. Do
you know what I mean?
People can do what they want with their time. It's all the excuses and absolutions that go along with it in the punk rock scene that make me chuckle.
|
im making no excusses for anything i like.
i like what i like.
again, i am able to get entertainment value out of things that i dont agree with.
another example is the dwarves.
they have songs about drug use.
i have never used drugs in my life(besides smoking weed like 3 times when i was in my early 20s)
but that dosent mean i cant listen to it because i dont do it.
i listen to alot of jah loving, pot smoking reggae music.
am i a pot smoking jah loving rasta guy?
no.
i have used this example on here before but....
there are death metal bands that sing about all kinds of crazyness.
do i like it?
no.
do i judge someone who listens to it?
no.
do i think that just because someone gets some enjoyment out of these types of bands that they do or believe everything or anything that these bands
say?
certainly not.
someone can listen to rap music that talks about shooting people in the head(myself included)
does that mean that every person listening to these songs is a gang bangin head shootin dude?
nope. again, it means nothing other than the fact that they enjoy listening to it.
so, do all these people have to make excusses for enjoying these types of music?
or is it just the fact that skrewdriver rubs you so wrong that you feel anyone who enjoys them is making "excusses"? |
There's always a disclaimer is all I'm saying "I'm not racist but I loooove me some Skrewdriver" or something like that. Maybe YOU don't do that but 9
out of every 10 people I've ever met that like that band do. And that's fine.... they can do what they want with their time. I'm just pointing out
that there seems to be some weird exception in punk rock where this is ok where it isn't accepted elsewhere in society. Like I said, what makes it ok?
The fact that it's set to music?
Well whatever. No sweat off my sack. Just something to think about is all.
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gavin
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
| Quote: | Originally posted by gavin
| Quote: | Originally posted by Mark Lind
I'm gonna take the bait on this one......
Only in punk rock is something like this acceptable. Think about it...... why is it ok to be into the racist stuff as long as it's set to music? You
can't get away with it in any other environment. You can't tell racist jokes around the water cooler at work and then say you don't really mean it. Do
you know what I mean?
People can do what they want with their time. It's all the excuses and absolutions that go along with it in the punk rock scene that make me chuckle.
|
im making no excusses for anything i like.
i like what i like.
again, i am able to get entertainment value out of things that i dont agree with.
another example is the dwarves.
they have songs about drug use.
i have never used drugs in my life(besides smoking weed like 3 times when i was in my early 20s)
but that dosent mean i cant listen to it because i dont do it.
i listen to alot of jah loving, pot smoking reggae music.
am i a pot smoking jah loving rasta guy?
no.
i have used this example on here before but....
there are death metal bands that sing about all kinds of crazyness.
do i like it?
no.
do i judge someone who listens to it?
no.
do i think that just because someone gets some enjoyment out of these types of bands that they do or believe everything or anything that these bands
say?
certainly not.
someone can listen to rap music that talks about shooting people in the head(myself included)
does that mean that every person listening to these songs is a gang bangin head shootin dude?
nope. again, it means nothing other than the fact that they enjoy listening to it.
so, do all these people have to make excusses for enjoying these types of music?
or is it just the fact that skrewdriver rubs you so wrong that you feel anyone who enjoys them is making "excusses"? |
There's always a disclaimer is all I'm saying "I'm not racist but I loooove me some Skrewdriver" or something like that. Maybe YOU don't do that but 9
out of every 10 people I've ever met that like that band do. And that's fine.... they can do what they want with their time. I'm just pointing out
that there seems to be some weird exception in punk rock where this is ok where it isn't accepted elsewhere in society. Like I said, what makes it ok?
The fact that it's set to music?
Well whatever. No sweat off my sack. Just something to think about is all. |
what makes it ok?
i dunno really
the same thing that makes chopping up women in death metal songs or shooting people up in rap songs ok i guess.
as far as skrewdriver goes i see it like this.......
it's one guys opinion about england and english politics at the time. i dont pretend to understand it since i wasnt there. but it's an expression of
frustration and anger, while different than the way i or you may have thought about it, it's very genuine.
the same way as all those ice cube songs from the early 90s about the koreans in black neighborhoods. i dont undertand that either since again i wasnt
there. but again, i see it as a genuine expression of anger and frustration. and again i personally dont agree with it but i can resepect the honest
feelings put behind it.
you come at the king....you best not miss
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defstarsteve
Posting Freak
Posts: 3505
Registered: 11-19-2003
Member Is Offline
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my wife buys weed from ice cube...
life is odd
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gavin
Posting Freak
Posts: 3973
Registered: 1-15-2005
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by defstarsteve
my wife buys weed from ice cube...
life is odd |
what?!?!
seriously???
you come at the king....you best not miss
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defstarsteve
Posting Freak
Posts: 3505
Registered: 11-19-2003
Member Is Offline
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my wife is good friends with cube's father in law....
and cube has his own strain of high end designer called o.g. coosh...
they invited my wife to come to a dodgers game and chill in cubes box...
LA is fucking weird
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clevohardcore
* Kick\'n ass on the wild side *
Posts: 12937
Registered: 9-19-2004
Member Is Offline
Mood: Sick Of It All, Youth Of Today
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| Quote: | Originally posted by defstarsteve
my wife is good friends with cube's father in law....
and cube has his own strain of high end designer called o.g. coosh...
they invited my wife to come to a dodgers game and chill in cubes box...
LA is fucking weird |
^^^^^^^^^ AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I would be cool to kick it with Ice Cube. AMeriKKKas most wanted was a kick ass album.
Each aspect of the soul has it's own part to play, but the ideal is harmonious agreement with reason and control.
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