The Middle East is still in the dark ages - Thorp and Sailor's Grave Board


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Thorp and Sailor's Grave Board » General Discussion » The Middle East is still in the dark ages

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newbreedbrian

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posted on 4-4-2010 at 06:47 PM

You want to start degrading into comments like "fuck you" you go right ahead man. You're not dragging me down into that. Thanks for making my last point better than I ever could though. I made a statement you disagreed with, you asked for me to expand, I did. My beliefs are based on the way I've seen the world in my time on this earth and haven't been arrived at without much thought on the subject.

We certainly have arrived at the crux of the problem. At the root of it, it's that personal faith isn't enough for some people. If your faith depends on everyone agreeing with you, I can't help you there. I question things Dave, which is what attracted me to punk rock in the first place. Doesn't matter what aspect of life, I'm in search of the truth even if it's one that's not going to make everyone happy. You want to proselytize on this site go for it. That's just making my point even further. I have no interest in converting anyone to atheism. It's a personal belief, that I could give a damn if anyone else shares or feels the need to belittle (and remember, it's still a view of the minority on this planet).

I'm done with this Dave. I don't mind debating issues, but I have no interest in walking on eggshells because of the prevalent notion that religion is a subject beyond questioning or criticism.

The very existence of flamethrowers proves that sometime, somewhere, someone said to themselves, ?You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I?m just not close enough to get the job done.? George Carlin

Mark Lind

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posted on 4-4-2010 at 11:12 PM

Religion as a concept seems to be positive. It's intended to give people a moral code and it's intended to help people live a better life with the afterlife as the reward. The problem with all that is that you don't need religion to be a good person. And people are capable of living full lives without the specter of an afterlife hanging over our heads.

My grandmother was a religious person. She lived a long and difficult life and I did my best to never try to take that away from her during her life. But even she as an 80+ year old woman understood that the bible is full of parables and fables that are intended to teach people lessons. I think that I could have had more intellectual based conversations on the topic and it never would have shaken her because she believed what she believed but she also grasped where it fit in society in 2009 (when she died).

The trouble is that for all the good that is written about the message that Jesus allegedly had, the majority of people don't get that. Or at least they don't live by that. How many people have been killed from wars where each side thought God was on their side? Right now we're involved with a religious war with Islam. Some will say it isn't so but this is very much Islam vs Christian. And the powers that be that make the decisions resulting in the deaths of innocent people have no business attaching themselves to a religion or a God. They're killers and, last I checked, there isn't really a religion that recommends the killing of innocent people.

Throughout history we've seen people kill in the name of a forgiving and loving God. The concept is a hypocritical at its core. And look at how the religious right represents itself in modern American politics..... capital punishment? Generally speaking the right is the party with God on its side and they're all for killing and waging war. They're also against giving to the least of us. Jesus Christ told us to visit the sick, feed the hungry and more and yet the religious right wants to deny healthcare and kick people off of welfare. Usually supported by statements like "we need to look out for our own". Well that's exactly the opposite of what Jesus Christ left for instructions (if you are to believe he ever existed). But they are against abortion so that's supposed to make all the rest ok? Oh and they're against homosexual rights for the most part.

I studied Catholicism for 12 years. Then I studied religion through the ages for two years in college. I'm pretty well familiar with the dogma. And I just don't think "religion" has anything to do with the message that started it all.

That was the nice way of saying it.

The mean way of saying it is I secretly judge anyone that tells me they are religious. If someone tells me they believe in God then I look at them in the exact same way that I would look at someone that thinks our water is being tainted with mind control chemicals or someone that thinks aliens live among us. But I also know that when I'm on my deathbed I will be frantically bargaining with that God in hopes that I am wrong. haha

And there's also a ton of encoded religious references in my songs that no one has ever picked up on. So fuck me.

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Jason the Magnificent

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posted on 4-5-2010 at 08:40 AM

This thread would be better if it was about Middle Earth.

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Thorp and Sailor's Grave Board » General Discussion » The Middle East is still in the dark ages