Tolerance of Christian Hardcore and the Ignorance of God\'s Contribution to

Rubisco - 9-21-2004 at 02:29 AM

Recently, I came across a thread on this board advocating for the boycott of Christian Hardcore. The title caught my attention and i decided to find out what the author was advocating and his reasons for his argument. The author of the original post did a fairly good job; outlining his key points and having a bit of support for his opinion.

Sadly, though, the rest of the contributions to the original were not of the same caliber. Rather than provide further ideas for discussion, the thread turned into a pornographic rant against religion. Not one person after the original author had one intelligent thing to add to the argument. Instead of using reason, they used emotion and crude humor to try to legitimize their hatred.

This is an antithesis to the short essay originally posted by the author. None of the other posts afterward require debate, as there was no idea to begin with. And yes, I am a Christian, but I will you show that an aggressive stance against Christian Hardcore to be foolish and ignorant without any biblical references or Christian dogmas. My argument, as you will see, stands just as strong even if there is no God.

One of the author\'s main points of argument is that Christian Hardcore is a new addition to a 20 year old tradition of Hardcore that has its own

Rubisco - 9-21-2004 at 02:35 AM

anyways, so it cut off the rest of the essay. But my main point was that Christain-based American law is what gives the ability for hardcore to exist. So dont be so hard on people who love Jesus and remembe that this Hardcore thing is just for fun.

We all have God to thank for Hardcore

BDx13 - 9-21-2004 at 03:04 AM

Rubisco -

First off, welcome to the Thorp Board. You should try editing you post (click the green edit button), or reposting the whole text again - poeple have certainly written more than that on these boards, and i dare say your entire argument would get people talking.

You should know that the thread you read about boycotting christian hardcore is actually the second version. The first version, and its six pages of responses, were lost when the boards crashed a few months ago. And while there was still a fair amount crap posting in that thread, there were some intelligible debates.

That said, this is the hate forum, and the author of the boycott post is here every day, so... let the drama begin! Enjoy.

BDx13 - 9-21-2004 at 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Boycott Christian HC

Quote:

Originally posted by Rubisco
We all have God to thank for Hardcore

Awesome! Thorp's first fake poster?

look at that, he beat me to it!

LilOz - 9-21-2004 at 11:30 AM

I never claimed to hate anything, but I thought the picture was hilarious and maybe some other people would too.

GabeTexasGAMC - 9-21-2004 at 02:44 PM

i hate white people.
i hate black people.
i hate asians.
i hate christians.
i hate everyone.
if they are stupid.
i hate you dude, for having a better vocabulary than me.
i hate you for being able to form complete sentences.
io bet you have a girlfriend too...
oooh fuck i really hate you.

Big Ugly - 9-21-2004 at 03:02 PM

The biggest complaint with religion in music is the attempt by some to force their beliefs on others. Being a devout atheist I have no desire to hear religioe vomit (thank you Jello) spewed forth through music. Because of this I usually try to avoid religious bands. I personally don't want any religion, be it Christian, Jewish, Buddist, Hindu, or whatever in hardcore because I don't think it's what hardcore is about. In the words of Roger Miret it's "all about one scene, unity!" You can't have unity when people are fighting over who's right or wrong. Fuck that shit. Hardcore is about brotherhood (I include women in this generalization before anyone gets mad) and fighting together against the outside world. Hardcore united!

tireironsaint - 9-21-2004 at 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rubisco
anyways, so it cut off the rest of the essay. But my main point was that Christain-based American law is what gives the ability for hardcore to exist. So dont be so hard on people who love Jesus and remembe that this Hardcore thing is just for fun.

We all have God to thank for Hardcore

You should also realize that most of the people who signed our Declaration of Independence and created our Constitution were NOT christians, that's a common misconception, but being common doesn't make it true. Most of those people were Deists, and while the laws may be similar to christian-judeo "laws", they are based on the common moral code in civilsed societies of the time. Keeping the church from taking control was a HUGE deal to them, that's why there is SUPPOSED to be a little thing called separation of church and state and thus you have things like ignorant goverment officials losing their jobs for trying to do something stupid like bringing a monument to the ten commandments into a court house.

As for HC or any underground scene, in my opinion, religion should not have a place. One of the stated goals in christianity and many other religions is to convert nonbelievers. Most people within the church will tell you that you are not doing all you can as a christian if you don't actively seek out and attempt to convert others. That's something I have a HUGE problem with and I think it's one of the main roots of Boycott's argument, at least that's how I see it.

And on the topic of your comment being cut back, I call MAJOR bullshit and being one of the longest winded assholes on this board (at least version 1), I know what i'm talking about. Thanks for the laugh though, it cracked me up to see someone complain about other people not posting real comments and then try to cover their lack of a real statement by blaming it on the board.

One more little comment, to a LOT of us, HC (and it's forerunner Punk) are much more than "just for fun". I know it saved my life and means at least as much to me as anything else in my life, fuck, it IS my life, so I take offense at people who claim it's just for fun. Good luck with that whole Jesus thing though.

Rubisco - 9-21-2004 at 06:56 PM

Thanks guys, this is great.

Several Things though:

1.) I did have a complete essay that was lost due to my lacking computer skills. I will re-post it in its entirty next week after exams when I have time.

2.)Separation of Church and State is NOT in the Constitution ANYWHERE.

3.)The author of the last post has lied. 50 out of the 52 men who were responsible for our Constitution were Christains. Thomas Jefferson and Ben Franklin were Deists, but the colonial form of Deism was not much different from Christianity. Deism is essentially Christianity except that they don't believe in miracles. It is a historical fact that 50 of the Founding Fathers were Christians. Look it up, go to the library, try and outsmart me. Please. Prove me wrong with textural referances. Read "America's Christain History: The Untold Story" by Gary DeMar, then bring me an agruement against the Christian Heritage of America. You can't.

Rubisco - 9-21-2004 at 07:07 PM

Oh yeah, which one of the ten commandments do you guys think are oppresive or unfair?

And atheism is an official religion, Atheist groups get Fedaral Funding under the label as a religious organization.

Also, how does Hardcore tell you have to lead your life? What value for human life does it have and were does that come from? Where does Hardcore say we go when we die? How does Hardcore explain why we feel? If Hardcore is a worldview, then it must answer these questions. It might, but I don't know the Hardcore answers. Maybe you all can educate me.

Finally, I read and write things like this for fun, I won't take offense to the opinions of others and I will listen to anyone else's ideas. All I ask is that you do the same for me. I'm just trying to get people thinking. Remember to read everything I write before you respond, so that you don't miss anything or misunderstand me.

But I gotta go, I hope you all have a great day!

tireironsaint - 9-21-2004 at 07:56 PM

Your points of debate are interesting.....
I don't have much time right now, but let me answer a couple of things off the top of my head.

1. Deism - The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation.

2. No one here is debating christianity in and of itself, just it's relation to HC, so for you to ask which one of the commandments is "oppressive or unfair" is ridiculous, it has nothing to do with the topic.

3. Telling us to read a book that supports your theory and then expecting us to provide counter argument BASED ON THAT, is beyond laughable.

4. Hardcore in and of itself does not address those points because it is not a religion. Do I need to expand on this? No, I don't think so.

5. I never said I was an Atheist. I can appreciate their arguments better than those of christians because they are based on logic and fact as opposed to "faith" and sleight of hand tactics like you are using here, but I am not an Atheist.

Oh, by the way, if you want to call me a liar, I'd appreciate it if you can show a reliable unbiased source for your statement.

moron - 9-21-2004 at 07:59 PM

the bible is a really nice story.

SAAAAARS - 9-22-2004 at 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Ugly
The biggest complaint with religion in music is the attempt by some to force their beliefs on others. Being a devout atheist I have no desire to hear religioe vomit (thank you Jello) spewed forth through music. Because of this I usually try to avoid religious bands. I personally don't want any religion, be it Christian, Jewish, Buddist, Hindu, or whatever in hardcore because I don't think it's what hardcore is about. In the words of Roger Miret it's "all about one scene, unity!" You can't have unity when people are fighting over who's right or wrong. Fuck that shit. Hardcore is about brotherhood (I include women in this generalization before anyone gets mad) and fighting together against the outside world. Hardcore united!

i didn't read the rest of the thread yet, i don't think anyone else will have said this but.. with or without religion, hardcore isn't really united. straight edge causes a huge barrier here, as does many other things. religion isn't the only thing keeping things from being united...

SAAAAARS - 9-22-2004 at 01:25 AM

i'm christian. i listen to a few christian bands. i go to their shows. and i go to other shows. kids stay respectful of me and i do the same by not throwing my god-loving shit in their faces. from what i can see, things go along pretty smoothly whether or not christianity is involved.

DAN SMASH - 9-22-2004 at 08:21 AM

To me, one of the main things about hardcore is it's advocacy to stand up for yourself and fight against what you believe, or know to be, wrong.

It is not all "fun", i agree with tireiron's comment that hardcore saved his life, it pretty much stopped me from falling down the slippery slope of self destruction, i have got to thank hardcore for that, not christianity.

Hardcore generally, tells one to seek out and smash their enemies down.
Christianity, on the other hand, tells one to embrace and forgive their enemies.

I choose hardcore.

Boycott's original post is valid and acceptable to me.

GabeTexasGAMC - 9-22-2004 at 10:56 AM

I nominate this for most ANOYING post of the year.
Who the fuck cares. Floorpunch and fuck shit up at home or at shows. Fucking assholes!

RomanticViolence - 9-23-2004 at 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GabeTexasGAMC
I nominate this for most ANOYING post of the year.
Who the fuck cares. Floorpunch and fuck shit up at home or at shows. Fucking assholes!

Ill vote on that!

Big Ugly - 9-23-2004 at 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rubisco
Oh yeah, which one of the ten commandments do you guys think are oppresive or unfair?

And atheism is an official religion, Atheist groups get Fedaral Funding under the label as a religious organization.

Also, how does Hardcore tell you have to lead your life? What value for human life does it have and were does that come from? Where does Hardcore say we go when we die? How does Hardcore explain why we feel? If Hardcore is a worldview, then it must answer these questions. It might, but I don't know the Hardcore answers. Maybe you all can educate me.

Finally, I read and write things like this for fun, I won't take offense to the opinions of others and I will listen to anyone else's ideas. All I ask is that you do the same for me. I'm just trying to get people thinking. Remember to read everything I write before you respond, so that you don't miss anything or misunderstand me.

But I gotta go, I hope you all have a great day!

I am an atheist but I don't collect money from the government for it nor do I sit around in a place of worship discussing it with others. Nor do I go around asking for donations. How is the Catholic church takes in tens of millions of dollars tax free every year yet the people they say they are going to help with that money never see any of it? There are thousands of poor and homeless and starving Christians in North America as we speak yet the church chooses to spend their money on tv ads and supporting politicians that see their way. Is this a good example they set foe the faithful? The Varican has more money then anyone yet their followers are still begging on the streets trying to feed their kids. Until the hypocrisy and corruption in the church ends, keep it away from the hardcore scene that means everything to me.

tireironsaint - 9-28-2004 at 12:15 PM

What happened to our little jesusboy? I guess he got discouraged after realizing nobody bought his bullshit.

xcut throatx - 9-30-2004 at 09:49 PM

I'm new here...sort of..I lurked here and had a username a long time ago, which I assume must have been deleted, I only had like 20 posts.. uh anyway I'm paul and i'm in Richmond, VA....anyways..now that I'm done introducing myself.

I don't neccesarily think that christians IN hardcore is bad but I don't think that adding yet another stupid clique to the hardcore scene is a good thing.

And as far as christian hardcore bands...its just not for me...I don't want to hear lyrics about jesus...it seems super-preachy in normal christian rock. keep it there.

defstarsteve - 10-2-2004 at 03:11 PM

the roots of hardcore are punk...
punk is not only music but a lifestyle against the mainstream lifestyle
force fed to you by this society

Christianity = the mainstream lifestyle in America

so as punks and hardcore kids it is our doctrine to be opposed to your beliefs

if you're proud of your religion rad
thanks I'm not buying
one of the good things I find about being an atheist is
I don't waste my time on your silly fiction, except for this post

I don't sit around and go man that non existent god thing, yeah that's lame

my time is devoted to the tangibles, that I have nothing but faith in
my children, my business, and my friends....

this is the basis of hardcore... that I still believe in

finding support and supporting those you can believe in

that you know you can rely on

you may say that's the basis for religion, as well
but I don't believe in miracles, just those things I can trust in, that I can touch and feel and know will be there when I need them...

not a fable....

my strength is from within...
yours is from a story, written by man, to control man....

tireironsaint - 10-4-2004 at 02:40 AM

Damn, Steve, that's gotta be the most I've ever seen you post at once and you didn't even mention Star Wars!!

Big Ugly - 10-4-2004 at 05:00 PM

I guess we can assume that the pederast who started this thread isn't coming back. We might as well let it go.

Hold up a minute

kev - 10-8-2004 at 01:27 PM

Let me present myself: I am christian and I am sxe.
Now will let everyone stereotype ideal of me be erased and actually listen.

Life isn't about hardcore. Do not claim thats its all you have and that it is about brotherhood and that its going to mean more than the normal person would understand. I forbid a genre of music to promote and describe who I am. Why is the fact that you have to pick on someone just because they don't like the style of music your into? I always hear about hardcore and how its meant for something and thats its more meaningful, there is more heart in it, more dedication and appreciation. If you believed in god and truly loved him. (Not the type of person who goes to church on easter and christmas and says prayer at the table when the grandparents are around) would't you want to play what is considered the most sincerest of music. Your all fighting a useless battle. You don't like Christianity, buddhism, hinduism, etc.... whatever but don't take away peoples' liberties of religion.

Honestly though two years ago I use to think I was hardcore and involved with the music scene. I realized shortly that it was a close-minded arena full of people who think that their better than everbody else for the simple reason because they listen to a band. The people are no different than the people who don't even attend shows. Listening to music doesn't decipher what type of person your going to be. If you believe that, well then I hope one day you realize you were lieing to yourself. Some bands are positive, others have an emotional feel to them, some just play catchy love songs, some sing about religion. Why don't you do something thast more beneficial with your time then hate. After awhile bands WILL break up.

Big Ugly - 10-8-2004 at 05:40 PM

While it was a well thought out post you will never convince me that you are right. I've been in the hardcore scene for more then 15 years, and I'm only 27 so you do the math. I've gotten more out of hardcore/punk/oi then I can rightfully express in words. I can listen to a band like Murphy's Law and instantly be cheered up no matter what kind of day I've had. I can listen to Blood For Blood and realize there are other people who feel the way I do, so I know that I'm not alone. I could give coutless examples but I don't have all day.

You talk about people being close minded but what about your religion? There a literally billions of people who don't believe in what your religion preaches, so where does that leave us in your mind. Cast out by your Judeo-Christian God, barred from entering Heaven and sampling it's pleasures because we don't think like you do? I speak for nobody on this board except myself when I say that I piss on your religion and all others. I blame them for millions upon millions of deaths throughout human history. I will openly call your God a fucking fiction and tell your little deity that he can suck me dry. Yours is a religion rife with archaic rules and laws that try to control peoples thoughts and actions. Why do you think there are so many child molesting faggot priests? Because you try to enforce a lifestyle that is unnatural and goes against human physiology. Why should I try to conform to a religon I don't believe in? I belive in hardcore because it's real, I can feel in my thoughts, I can feel it in my fucking veins. I can connect with people in a way not provided by religion. Fuck your God. I know where I'm going when I die. Six feet under in a pine box. Not heaven or hell, I going where the worms will eat my rotting corpse and that will be the end of my exsistance.

tireironsaint - 10-9-2004 at 03:25 AM

Since I've been one of the biggest mouthed people replying in this thread I will assume that some of what you (kev) are saying is more or less aimed directly at me. I can see that you tried to make a thought provoking post here, but you've missed the point entirely. No one is saying christians have no right to their religion, what is being contested is their "right" to invade the HC scene. As far as your misunderstanding about how some of us feel about HC, I don't think anyone (and certainly not me) feels that HC is all there is to life. Before you go telling us that we're all closed-minded maybe you should take the time to really make sure you comprehend what we are saying. And yes, I realize there are a lot of posts that are less than serious where some of us just slag on religion, did you ever stop to think WHY so many people do that? I think it boils down to a lifetime of people telling us how horrible we are for not accepting something they want us to, people condemning us all to "hell" for not buying into their faith. To change the main subject in part of your post to religion instead of HC, I think it could very easily be said that "I realized shortly that it was a close-minded arena full of people who think that their better than everbody else for the simple reason because they" believe in something I don't. Buying into one religion doesn't determine what type of person you're going to be either, aside of course, from being a person who is being lied to and who laps it up.

Big Ugly - 10-12-2004 at 06:54 PM

Why is it these Jesus freaks post once and never come back to debate the answers given them. Oh, I guess it's cause they know they're wrong.

RomanticViolence - 10-12-2004 at 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Ugly
Why is it these Jesus freaks post once and never come back to debate the answers given them. Oh, I guess it's cause they know they're wrong.

Im totally with you on that.

clevohardcore - 10-14-2004 at 12:40 PM

Everyone is here and entitled to there beliefs. Athiest as moronic as that is ok fro you to chose. same goes for anyone with any connection to a religion. If you boycott christian hardcore then boycott it. Doesn't mean I can't listen to it. In fact the only bands I no are christian that I have in my collection is NO INNOCENT VICTIM(don't even try and say they suck). then you say everything hardcore sucks. Also (I have a tape of a band many of you may not even know is a band called CRASHDOG. this scene is more open to HARE CHRISHNAS(however you spell it) ie. (shelter, 108) than a CHRISTIAN. That is no differnet than modern day america. It's more wrong to be catholic than any other religion. Whatever. The older i get the more I feel the importance of religion. Not to say I am devoted but I see what people like or get from it. So don't boycott what people hold true. Support what they believe because they are free to do so. As well as you are to choose not to.

Sorry this is not too hate filled to be here just thought I 'd throw in my 2 cents.

So fuck shit piss!

clevohardcore - 10-14-2004 at 12:43 PM

Whatever you choose is all good, but NO INNOCENT VICTIM kick much ass.

tireironsaint - 10-14-2004 at 02:13 PM

Maybe you missed it, but I said I think Krishna shit is just as bad earlier on and for the 100th time, NOBODY IS SAYING THAT PEOPLE SHOULDN'T BE RELIGIOUS (if that's what they want or need) JUST THAT IT SHOULD BE KEPT OUT OF HC.

Oh, and by the way, No Innocent Victim suck much balls.

clevohardcore - 10-14-2004 at 03:34 PM

HC is about being you and if you are religious go right on. If no one likes it they will not attend shows and the band may break up. Just like NO INNOCENT VICTIM.

If you do not like N I V then you do not like sick of it all or agnostic front. Dude because they mirror them to a tee. It's ok though.

clevohardcore - 10-14-2004 at 03:36 PM

So you think all religion should be out of hardcore. Well then you have NO hardcore.
No cromags no badbrains no madball no everyone else. They all praise god for guidance. Heck even ALL OUT WAR sometimes thank god.

Big Ugly - 10-14-2004 at 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by clevohardcore
HC is about being you and if you are religious go right on. If no one likes it they will not attend shows and the band may break up. Just like NO INNOCENT VICTIM.

If you do not like N I V then you do not like sick of it all or agnostic front. Dude because they mirror them to a tee. It's ok though.

NIV do NOT mirror AF and SOIA to a t. Those two bands are amazing and are innovators. NIV is rehashed music with horrible fucking vocals and cheesy lyrics. I for one am glad they are no more. They licked balls and in no way measured up to SOIA and weren't worthy of polishing Stigma's boots. The last thing the scene needs is Jesuscore, Jewcore, Krishnacore, or any other religioncore.

clevohardcore - 10-14-2004 at 05:11 PM

Wow man wait a second. I in no way am saying NIV is as respected or given the cred SOIA or AF should have. No way at all. Waht I am saying is they do cop the sound of that style of hardcore which in my book is great music. all I am saying is how can you dislike NIV and like SOIA and AF. Style of music is very similar. It's real hardcore no matter how you put it. Oh by the way NIV are back together and playing a club near you very soon. Just thought I'd pass that on.
SOIA and AF are the greats and thats what niv I assume grew up on or are influenced by and carry the torch in there own way.
I don't want to prop NIV so much because I like them and have a cd and a 7" but by no means am a diehard fan of them. They impressed we when I picked there music up thats all I got to say. It's kind of like listening to IGNITE's old shit. I won't go out and sabatage a fishing boat but will jam out old IGNITE anyday.

tireironsaint - 10-15-2004 at 06:45 PM

Sorry man, just because some band rips off a good band's style doesn't make them worth a shit. And again, you seem to be missing the point, I'm still trying to understand how you can say there's no hardcore without religion.

kev2 - 12-3-2004 at 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RomanticViolence

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Ugly
Why is it these Jesus freaks post once and never come back to debate the answers given them. Oh, I guess it's cause they know they're wrong.

Im totally with you on that.

Ok this is Kev. I am back. I forgot my name. None the less I don't know why I am in a forum. As part of Christianity your suppose to spread the word in a positive way. To increase followers. Call me a Jesus Freak, Its something I am proud of. Go ahead and say your hardcore. I find that humorous but none the less you feel that way about Chrisitianity. I feel that maybe I lowered my degree to a lower stand. I made fun of hardcore. I should have realized that what I was doing was putting down a belief that was just like mine. Although mine dates back and is observed by millions of people, hardcore is observed by others and it should be respected by people too. Trust me, I am not a hxc dick. I am not a fundamentalist. I didn't even vote for George Bush because I think he is possibly the antichrist. I do agree Christianity has its flaws. Heck, the holy roman was split into two where there was a pope and an antipope. They molested little boys and the arch dioses just relocated them to another area and let them continue. Church people use to stand outside of abortion clinics protesting. I think there should be free choice even though killing was wrong.Trust me, I find things about Christianity just as sick as you. I have a relationship with god and jesus christ not the church. Church people I will honestly say are more manuplative and thats why I don't go as much but my love for God hasnt change. Hate mosh me and tell me about how God can suck on this or that they should stab Jesus with a few more tools and that you could care less. Believe what you want to believe. I'll respect that. Let hardcore be your savior or whatever you want. I find my life meaningful with god. Thats probaly the only difference between you and I. I apologize if bands have been heavy influenced in this genre and that you feel that they have slandered it in anyway. Bands should try to be the same and not produce anything out of the boundarys of pop punk and Hot Fm radio. I am going to leave hardcore to the real bands and tell all my Christian friends to pursue something that doesn't have any thought proviking measures. Sorry I am bitter but music wouldn't be anyhting if bands didn't try something. In closing. I don't go to shows anymore, I don't associate with anybody in the scene anymore, I don't know what the in thing is. I hear guys are wearing girl pants and that throwing down is beating people up and sxe people can break rules and still have complete credibility. Thats all I know. Believe what you want to believe. I don't have anything to do with you people now a days anyways.

Big Ugly - 12-3-2004 at 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kev2

Quote:

Originally posted by RomanticViolence

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Ugly
Why is it these Jesus freaks post once and never come back to debate the answers given them. Oh, I guess it's cause they know they're wrong.

Im totally with you on that.

Wearing girl pants is for emo faggots and fans of utter shit like 18 Visions and Atreyu. Personally I'd rather listen to cats fuck then listen to that meaningless tripe. These guys that are wearing chick pants are the ones dying their long hippy hair blck, wearing eyeliner, and writing fucking poetry. They have nothing to do with the REAL hardcore scene and get no respect from the scene. Fighting has been called "throwing down" for years and started in the hip hop scene, not the hardcore scene. If you are edge you can't break, or even bend the rules. Either you're edge or you're not. It's a black and white issue, there is no grey area.

For you to say that there's nothing thought provoking in hardcore just shows how little your brainwashed little mind really knows. If you look at real punk and hardcore there are countless numbers of bands who have a had a lot to say. Take a look at Agnostic Front, Sheer Terror, Conflisct, Crass, Dead Kennedy's, Bad Religion, DOA, Defiance, etc. The list goes on and on. It sounds to me that the only things that are thought provoking are those that invoke the name of you're false God. I still say Jesus is a myth and the bible is a work of well thought out fiction. The onus of proof is not on me asshole. Prove to me your worthless cunt of a God exsits and I'll praise his name. Until that time you can take your fuckin bible and shove it right up your pretentious, priest-molested ass.

I think Slayer said it best when they said "I keep the bible in a pool of blood so that none of it's lies can affect me!"

SAAAAARS - 12-4-2004 at 12:27 AM

some people believe in god
some people don't
some bands will mention god in their lyrics
some bands wont
listen to what you like
don't listen to the rest

nothing said on a messageboard is going to change the way anyone thinks on this sort of matter

why is this such an on going argument?

Big Ugly - 12-4-2004 at 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SAAAAARS
some people believe in god
some people don't
some bands will mention god in their lyrics
some bands wont
listen to what you like
don't listen to the rest

nothing said on a messageboard is going to change the way anyone thinks on this sort of matter

why is this such an on going argument?

Because both sides fiercely believe in what they're saying and want to get their points across. Don't like it, don't read it. It's just that simple.

SAAAAARS - 12-5-2004 at 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Ugly

Quote:

Because both sides fiercely believe in what they're saying and want to get their points across. Don't like it, don't read it. It's just that simple.

no one ever brings up any new points or anything that makes this even the slightest bit intriguing.

what happens after you get your point across?
cause i think you/everyone has...

Newt80 - 2-11-2005 at 03:32 PM

well i don't have anything to add...other than christian hc still sucks a fat one! hahahaha.

SmashHit518 - 2-12-2005 at 04:10 PM

Bad Brains

MENTALxRUSS - 5-6-2005 at 12:36 PM

i listen to some christian hardcore like point of recognition, count the coast, and in due time... however i don't really care for any religion. good music is good music weather you choose to listen and follow the words and views shared is entirely up to you!
i do hate however going to shows and seeing christian bands preach on stage. if i wanted to see preaching i'd go to church...
instead i think that christian bands should do their thing and pray before the set and then just play the music... cause hardcore aint about trying to brain wash people or talk their fucking ear off... it's about having a good time and getting a message of what ever it maybe across through music!
and i for one love the music... whither or not i believe in the message is a different story but i love hardcore music... from fast and posi to load and tough! hardcore is just a positive way to get out some negativity... and most of all to have fun! get away from lifes stresses...
well that's my 2 cents...